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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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Sorry to vent but had to tell someone- I've been working on my 56 Victoria on and off for 6 years. Bought it as a basket case. Rebuilt engine, put in a 4 speed, everything new (brakes, lines, fuel tank, radiator, radio, etc.) Like most old cars the wiring had been "worked" on over the years. So I went completely over it, replaced most, and had all lights working. Sent car to body shop this spring and got it back about a month ago. So now I can start putting all the weather seals, gaskets, bumpers on it. In putting the lights back in I have come up with a problem that keeps eluding me. I have both tail lights but only one brake light, sometimes I have one front parking light, no turn signals, and so far I have one head light, either dim or dimmer. Not sure what happened! Battery ground is to block and body and another ground strap at rear of block. Oh yeah- I also lost my high beam indicator light in the dash. Radio works as do the dash lights and interior light. If you have any idea what to look at let me know. I'm so close to having it on the road but have to get by this electrical issue. Thanks!
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By PWH42 - 16 Years Ago
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For some reason or other,you've lost the ground between all the components.The body is not grounded properly to the frame or the battery is not grounding completely. Since you just had the car painted,there is probably some paint where there was none before.Try cleaning every geound connection and see if that helps. Good luck.These kind of things can really make you pull your hair out.
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By crenwelge - 16 Years Ago
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I would look for a bad ground first. If that's not the problem, look at your bulbs. The lead contact against the brass pigtail causes electrolysis. Scrape the contact on your bulbs and your pigtails.
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By paul2748 - 16 Years Ago
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To check for a ground problem, make up some leads that you can temporarily attach to the light housings and the frame. Make sure the battery is grounded to the engine and the engine to both the body and the frame. Scrape the paint away where these grounds attach. Now you are ready to check the lights out by attaching the temporary grounds.
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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This was my first thought- I even added a ground wire from battery to body by radiator support. I had battery grounded to engine by generator and ground strap from engine to firewall. Like I said I have both tail lights, just one brake light. All dash lights work except high beam indicator. And the headlights have their own ground wire in the loom to the junction block on the left fender. ALL the bulbs are new and work. As is the ignition switch and light switch. I have had to walk away from this project for a few days after fighting it all weekend. But I'm ready to start again. When I find problem I'll let you know.
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By Glen Henderson - 16 Years Ago
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The pin type terminals use on a 57 are bad about corroding inside the junction blocks. Get a good spray terminal cleaner and a small wire brush and clean all the affected pins and sockets. Maybe just a bad connection.
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By Teros292 - 16 Years Ago
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For the brake light, check turn signal switch. If you have one brake light then the brake light switch works. Does the turn signals work? All these goes through turnsignal switch.
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 16 Years Ago
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Just a thought. In the junction block on the inner fender, some of the connections are singles straight through, some are doubles, which can make a 3 or 4 way connection. Might be where things are crossed up. On a job like this, we always want the problem to be caused by one snafu, and fixing that will fix all the problems. This is not necessarily true. Sometimes you have to attack one problem at a time until they are all solved.
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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I have not replaced the turn signal assy yet. But I do have a new one to put in. Old one had wires cut off (maybe a problem) and I repaired them while hunting for new unit. As for the pins on the fender--- there is an idea! I never knew some fed miltiple pins. That would account for trouble with headlights and maybe front markers. THANKS SO MUCH FOR BOTH OF THESE SUGGESTIONS
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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Started at junction box - found out of the 8 pins only 6 were hot. 4 for headlights, 2 for parking lights, 2 dead- no front turn signals. At the rear of car I have both tail lights and only right turn. Forgot to check brakes. I think my next step is to install new turn signal switch in column, since these wires were cut off when I bought car. Hopefully I will get this repaired this weekend! Then on to new carb and install alternator to replace generator. My wheels have been sand blasted and are at powder coater. New tires and I should be on the road.
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By Doug T - 16 Years Ago
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Check out the shop manual on pg 259 for a schematic of the turn signals and pg 269 for a color coded diagram of the push-in junction on the driverside inner fender. The schematic on 259 will really help with installing the new turn signal switch and the other diagram shows exactly how these junctions serve to split the wiring as John mentioned. I am sorry my scanner isn't working so I could post these diagrams.
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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UPDATE- Found the sockets on parking lights were loose, causing bulbs to work sometime (sometimes not) also found that one headlight bulb was causing a back-feed. Don't know how but it would show up only when bulb was plugged in. Going to fix these things then move on to turn signals. Still have dash apart and steering wheel pulled. I WILL BEAT THIS YET
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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OK- This has me wondering- If I check my headlight wiring without any bulbs hooked up everything looks good. 3 wires check out ground, low beam and high beam. But when I plug a bulb in and check wires both of the high and low beam wires have electricity. Tried a new bulb, same thing. Is there something inside a bulb that causes this?
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 16 Years Ago
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Are you sure that you do not have 1 high beam and 1 low beam wire plugged into one of the siamesed connectors in the junction block on the inner fender?
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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I had everything apart and cleaned, then put back together. Wires are 100% correct. Problem only occurs when bulb is plugged in. Both old and new. Unplug bulb and wires only show hot one at a time. I ended up taking meter to new bulb and it showed conductivity at connections. I had never even thought of doing this before in all my years working on cars. I just replaced bulb if it didn't work. This was a total shock to me but I guess I'm going to put it back together as is and see what happens. I still have the turn signals and brake lights to figure out. I'm in the process of figuring out how to replace sockets in 56 turn signal housings.
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By charliemccraney - 16 Years Ago
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Is that a 3 prong bulb? Do you have the wires in the correct terminals. I think both filaments share a ground. If you have 1 hot wire going to the ground terminal of the bulb, maybe it will allow both to come on at either the hi or low setting. What happens if you hit the high beam switch?
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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3 prong. If I had wires wrong only one side of bulb would work, both work. Like I said, I ran a meter on the bulb and it showed conductivity at all the prongs. Both new and old bulb.
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By charliemccraney - 16 Years Ago
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The way I see it is if you have a hot wire going to the bulb ground terminal and the ground wire going to one of the bulb hot terminals then when one of the lights is on, it may be hi beam, it may be low beam, the common ground will complete the circuit and cause both filaments to light up. I'm not sure if that is actually how it might work. Anyone else see what I'm getting at?
Have you made sure that the wires are going to the proper terminals? Since it happens with different bulbs, I think you have wires crossed somewhere.
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By rick55 - 16 Years Ago
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This problem usually surfaces when you have an earth problem. If all the lights come on with reduced brilliance this is definitely the problem.
If they all come on and are full brilliance, it can only be one of three things.
The supply to the lights is wrong, the plug connections on the firewall are mixed up remembering that some plugs on the firewall are siamesed, the connection to the pigtails (to the lights) is wrong or you have a faulty headlight dip switch.
There is of course one other possibility and that is that if you have relays fitted to the headlights, these are faulty.
You say you have a meter or test light, confirm that only wire to each light has power when you turn the lights on. If that is the case it will be the earth problem or the plug to the light is wired incorrectly.
One other thing that I have experienced in the past is that if the light holder is not tight, it is sometimes possible to put the globe in the socket incorrectly and if this happens you end up shorting across both terminals in the holder with the soldered end of the globe. It then makes its own shorted connection in the lampholder. This is also possible, though I would think unlikely if everything worked before you started. This can happen with stop/light sockets -though not sure with the headlight plugs you are using.
Sometimes these problems seem to be a nightmare, but the solution is almost always very simple.
Hope this helps.
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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This is the LAST question to complete this puzzle- Looking at the back of the bulb you see 3 prongs. 1 on top and the others at each side. Which one is ground, which one high beam and which one low beam?
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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If anyone can answer the bulb question I think I will have this part of the project completed. I really believe that at sometime in the past the wires were crossed up at the headlight bulb. I have never had this car together or on the road in the 6 years I've owned it and I bought it as a basket case. I have checked and re-checked the wiring and it is correct all the way to the bulbs. I just need to know that the bulb is wired correctly with the new plugs.
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 16 Years Ago
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Looking at the back of the bulb, with the center terminal facing "up", the left terminal is ground, the center is lo and the right is hi.
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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Thank you all- I now have tail lights, parking lights and both head lights with "no" backfeed. Now on to brake lights and turn signals. THANK YOU AGAIN
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By John Mummert - 16 Years Ago
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You mentioned that you had the wheels powder coated.Make sure you check the lug nuts after a few miles. I've had wheels that were ready to fall off after 5 miles because of paint on brake drums and wheels.
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By Ol'ford nut - 16 Years Ago
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Everything is working 100%. Thanks again to all! My next project is to install a alternator. Not a one wire as I have heard they don't like to generate at low rpm's. I do have another electrical question- The body wiring harness gets it juice from a connection on the starter solenoid. You would think that would be an excellant place for a circuit breaker. So I would like to put one in-line. What amp size breaker would I need?
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By Hoosier Hurricane - 16 Years Ago
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I would match the circuit breaker rating to the output amperage of the alternator, just in case it ever put full amperage into the battery. That wouldn't protect the small wires in the circuit though. Some cars used a fusible link in that location, but it is a one shot deal. If it blows, you have to replace it. I think replacements are available at your local parts store.
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By DANIEL TINDER - 16 Years Ago
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I do have another electrical question- The body wiring harness gets it juice from a connection on the starter solenoid. You would think that would be an excellant place for a circuit breaker. So I would like to put one in-line. What amp size breaker would I need?[/quote]
I installed a 30 amp breaker 10 years ago after reading Jay Raine's EarlyBird article (sorry, lost the issue date).
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