|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
well i know there are several ppl on here running turbos on the y-blocks but my searches turned up nuttin. I alway thought turbos were for ricers but now im seeing that it might be kinda neat. So show me and tell me about your setups and what your performance is and such. I Also have some questions as im really new to turbos. What kind of effect would one have on effeciency (yes i realize they are mostly for performance so mpg isnt a concern but im curious). What size and kind of turbos are you guys adapting and how do you have it all plumbed? and just any general info anyone feels like sharing on the subject?
|
|
By charliemccraney - 15 Years Ago
|
Ah, yes. Turbos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnNk0ZmLvVA
This is my favorite Y Block turbo video. The Hollow Heads can tell you more.
And there's Bill
Should you need turbo services, contact one of "us" www.supernaturalturbo.com.
I've always heard turbos can allow a vehicle to be more efficient, ie better mileage but I have yet to own one to know. So far, with everything I've done to my engine, my mileage has not decreased so I think it's a safe assumption with the turbo. Like many performance mods, I'm sure it depends more on your own ability to control your foot. Some time in the not too distant future....
|
|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
wow never though a turbo whine could be so stinking cool. keep the pics and videos coming i love it. And add any information you feel is relevant at all to this because like i said i did a search and nothing came up.
|
|
By Hollow Head - 15 Years Ago
|
|
Ok, Mr flatbedford... Sorry that our sites ( www.hollowheads.net ) are kinda messy, but you can find my story about turbocharging the Y behind projects / Hollow Machine ( that Hot Rod lookalike thing ) and scrolling past the pics. The story is the same as published in Y-block Magazine, put there is no pics in it. We will put all that turbo stuff to Technical Innovations section / Turbo Engine after I have collected all the good pictures together and when i get the texts ready. Lots of pics, lots of memories  Also, all our videos about Twin Turbo Y and Single Turbo Y are linked at the Videos section. Enjoy, while I figure out our pics and texts....
|
|
By Hollow Head - 15 Years Ago
|
|
And for all who are interested about our sites, please tell us your suggestions how to improve our sites. Here in Finland winters are long and almost nothing happens here then. Exept in garages... . So, updates may seem to be in minimum, but our brains are not resting... Lots of technical improvements are crawling under our hollow heads. Some of them will be done actually and some will end up to trash. Two big turbos and a set of bigger fuel injectors are on the wish list, but those reguire some cash that we don't have at the moment  . You never know, what happens next...
|
|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
wow you guys are coming up with some crazy stuff and im loving all of it. you guys are really thinking outside of the box and you really have my mind racing now as to what i could do.
|
|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
well i read through your build of the hollow machine and i have got to say i absolutely love it. you took a pile of nothing and built stuff out of it which is really cool. im also likeing all the different setups that you experiemented with and i have got to say that you torque number blew me away, over 400 ft/lbs, AWESOME. Now as far as turbo size goes how big is required? and following common sense if two are used would they only need to be half as big? And is there a significant difference in design of turbos for diesel and gas. I think i have a buddy that has the stock turbo off his 96 cummins would something like that work for my 292? how much booste pressure is safe in these motors. I would also be interested in considerations to take into account when building a turboed motor. Im thinking compression would have to be lower than otherwise like 8:1 or so and heads might need work (in either case but would it be more important?),What about cam profiles (more aggressive? closer to stock?), Piston shape (flattops, dished, etc). Thats a lot of questions and i relize you guys arent absolute experts on this subject but you know more than me.
|
|
By Hollow Head - 15 Years Ago
|
|
Well, it all depends how serious one would go . Compression ratios back in the old days were kept quite low because of detonation issues. The more you feed air and gasoline to your engine, more heat is generated by burning it and that makes detonation more likely to occur if same amount of ignition advance is used. Today with computer controlled ignition devices you can retard ignition with knock sensor information or by tuning the charts by revs and boost amount. If compression ratios were from 7.5:1 to 8.5:1 in the eighties, now it's possible to use 10:1 to 12:1 easily. Turbo size? Reed P. would be the right person to ask this about, but of course turbos from diesel engines are designed to work in lower rpm levels when compared with turbos from gasoline engines. Also huge truck diesels with engine capasities over 10 liters produce more exhaust gases to propell the turbos than tiny Y-blocks. Our next goal is to get two turbos that are good enough to 450+ hp each. Then it's different story how we get the Y to hold that stress what they generate. With the right size of a turbo you can eliminate the problem which we had when the single turbo itself was braking the engine with exess back pressure below the turbo flange. Also, the lag issue can be eliminated with correct sizing of parts used. Stock or slightly ported heads are ok with low boost pressures. They might be ok with even lot more, but we had only 0.7 bar boost pressure at the dyno. But, the more you get them to flow, the more you can get hp from your engine. Today people are using well over 3 bar of boost pressure with their cars in drifting, drag racing and on the streets. Big pressures just generate new problems to solve with engines. Head gaskets must be different, overall sealing of the engine must be considered also, because sometimes that boost may get to the wrong side of the piston and blows gaskets and oil from the engine. Also the pistons should be forged with high pressures and high heat levels. As you have red, we tried to save on everything, because we really didn't think it would work or last for a minute at the start  . For the next bottom end we are thinking of better connecting rods, better pistons and a main stud girdle to hold it together. And of course changing to E85 as a fuel. That will keep the engine cooler and give us a change to use more ignition advance because E85 is not so prone to detonation. As a camshaft I recommend mild grinds. In turbo engines exess overlap can cause problems. With a stock camshaft you can expect 30-35 percent increase in power. Wild cams may have crucial effects in torque curves. What else? Just go for it and get some experiments. Electronic fuel injection is the key to succes but it can be done effectively with carbs too. We are updating our sites with lots of pictures about our project so stay tuned. Some of those might be there after Monday when teros292 get all that stuff put there that I have mailed to him. Oh, and yes... buy a book or two about turbocharging engines. easy and cheap way to avoid expensive mistakes and easier to read than from computer and the thousand different sites  . And keep asking, we try to figure out the problems...
|
|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
wow thats was a lot of help. thanks a ton. As of right now my plan is to build a fuel injection system with megasquirt some how (probably gunna borrow a lot of your guys ideals). then im going to have to see what i can find for turbos as i dont think i can afford to drop a grand or more on just turbos but hopefully i can find some stock ones off of something that have been swapped out or something as i would really like to run dual turbos as i just like the symmetrical look in the engine bay but we will see one might have to work. So if i was to find a turbo or turbos off of a similar sized engine they should be about right as far as flow? (what about something designed for the 4.6 or 5.0l ford mustang?) Im not building a race car but i would like to sqeeze a good amount of power out of my motor as it is going to go into 59 f100 with 4x4 so it will be heavier than most. Also this truck is my planned on daily driver that i want to last a long time so i will keep the booste low.
|
|
By Hollow Head - 15 Years Ago
|
|
Treasure hunting at the junkyard! Of course two ideal turbos is a must if planning Twin turbo set up and then you have to check the openin point of the wastegates to be ideal also. This one tickles my mind. Twin Turbo at the trunk of some 50's Ford like '54 Vicky or something... And boost levels like this guy has... . Read on... http://images.google.fi/imgres?imgurl=http://image.musclemustangfastfords.com/f/9841275/mmfp_0804_02_z%2Brear_mounted_turbocharged%2B.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/features/mmfp_0804_1989_mustang_eat_race_die/photo_02.html&usg=__u1DogPjbtbbwN596Bb_lUQ2KkmA=&h=480&w=640&sz=106&hl=fi&start=6&itbs=1&tbnid=D9PwV5jFnx35XM:&tbnh=103&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dturbocharged%26hl%3Dfi%26gbv%3D2%26tbs%3Disch:1
|
|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
wow 30psi thats gotta be getting close to a ticking time bomb but a set up like that would be awesome in an older car. Guess i will have to go to the local junkyard and see what i can turn up for turbos, im afraid that the pickings might be kinda slim tho.
|
|
By charliemccraney - 15 Years Ago
|
|
I want to try a rear mounted turbo. I thought of it a few years ago. After talking to some older, experienced people who for the most part told me it wouldn't work, and now seeing them in use, and working, I definitely gotta try it.
|
|
By LordMrFord - 15 Years Ago
|
I'm skeptic about that.
Turbo lag must be huge and exhaust gasses gets colder. How it gonna work on streets?
|
|
By 59flatbedford - 15 Years Ago
|
|
yea there could be problems with mounting the turbo so far away from the motor not to mention all the extra plumbing it would take but it would be really cool for a sleeper car.
|
|
By Hollow Head - 15 Years Ago
|
|
Jep, that is the common mistake people think. With correct sizing of the turbine wheel the lag can be eliminated and with full length headers the exhaust pulses will push gases well to the rear. Ok, they may be a bit cooler and their energy may be bit lower but as shown that method works fine. also, when routing pressurized intake air from back via aluminum and correctly sized pipes, that eliminates the need of intercooler. Or at least reduces the size of it. Here is one Finnish example how that system works... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFZkkjkkOt4&feature=related And here something to read.. interesting! http://www.ststurbo.com/uni_installation
|
|
By charliemccraney - 15 Years Ago
|
I don't know much about turbos, but I know rear mounted turbos have been done and work. Check out Squires Turbo Systems. I also know that a lot of people told me it can't be done. I've come to learn that when people say something can't be done, it generally can. It just requires a different approach than is customary. I call it a subconscious lie. If one can think of something, it can be done. The question is how hard will you work to make it happen. "Genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration," Thomas Edison. Many of the technologies we have right now were once thought to be impossible.
The reason I originally thought of it was simply to keep it cleaner under the hood. Squires has done a lot of research and it turns out there are other benefits.
A person looking at the truck: "Say, where does that pipe go?"
Me: "Oh, it's just a cold air intake."
|
|
By LordMrFord - 15 Years Ago
|
|
charliemccraney (4/12/2010)
A person looking at the truck: "Say, where does that pipe go?"
Me: "Oh, it's just a cold air intake."
I can imagine,here in Finland, where we have annual routine inspection for cars with hp limits and stuff, that dialog have been heard many times between inspector and owner.
|
|
By pegleg - 15 Years Ago
|
|
Charlie, It can and has been done. wrap the headers and head pippes to keep the exhaust gas temp up. the induction lenth would be the only issue.
|
|
By charliemccraney - 15 Years Ago
|
This is the turbo sound I'm after. This particular car has no mufflers. Most of the STS systems use no mufflers. Sorry guys, it's a 'vette.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffzerf6CyO8
Oh, here you go, a Mustang.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV8dN3wfgY4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eomxo8-yLC4
I love that sound! So I guess they might believe my cold air intake story until I start it up.
|
|
By GregW - 15 Years Ago
|
|
I highly recomend Maximum Boost by Corky bell. Lots of information on turbo setups. 59flatbedford (4/8/2010)
well i know there are several ppl on here running turbos on the y-blocks but my searches turned up nuttin. I alway thought turbos were for ricers but now im seeing that it might be kinda neat. So show me and tell me about your setups and what your performance is and such. I Also have some questions as im really new to turbos. What kind of effect would one have on effeciency (yes i realize they are mostly for performance so mpg isnt a concern but im curious). What size and kind of turbos are you guys adapting and how do you have it all plumbed? and just any general info anyone feels like sharing on the subject?
|
|
By 57FordPU - 15 Years Ago
|
|
I agree. Maximum Boost is a great resource. I have read it cover-to-cover twice and it is an easy read compared to others I have tried. Lots of info for sizing, performance ranges, and different setups. It is not impossible, but improbable that you would build a system from reading a book. However, what it does is allow you to talk the language and discuss your plans with someone with experience like Reed. Are you listing Reed? Hope so...... Charlie, I like your idea of the rear mounted turbo. I saw it installed on a vette a couple of years ago in an episode of HorsePower TV. I don't remember the numbers, but it was a remarkable change from stock. They say past episodes are available on DVD at www.powerblocktv.com. They gave tips about problems to overcome unlike a book would. Here are a couple of links showing STS turbo youtube rear install applications and the web site giving views of TV shows that installed their units. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnFA93_U9hY&feature=related http://www.ststurbo.com/tv_episodes
|