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By The Master Cylinder - 15 Years Ago
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Hello,
I was reading an article on Y-Blocks the other day and it stated that the rubber grommets for the valve covers were supposed to be installed under the valve cover.
I had never heard this before so I looked in a couple of parts catalogs and sure enough it show them in an exploded view with them being installed first on the stud, followed by the valve cover, washer and nut on the outside.
Do any of you install it this way? How would you know how far down to install it on the stud and leave enough pressure so the gasket sealed.
I can see how it would prevent over tightening and crushing the metal valve cover and maybe sealing better on the inside as opposed to the outside.
Any thoughts??
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By stuey - 15 Years Ago
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hi there a while back there was an article on building a Y-block that appeared in "Street Rodder" and later in "Classic Truck" magazines by Doc Fromader. it detailed how he did it with a bunch of nuts on the valve cover studs to get the grommets sitting at the right height. i coudn't figure how you got the right squeeze on both the grommet and the valve cover gasket? stuey
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By nonne_56 - 15 Years Ago
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Hi There is some pic's and info about this on www.egge.com in the tech info about y-blocks, take a look.http://www.webrodder.com/article.php?AID=385&SID=9&CID=15 Nonne
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By MoonShadow - 15 Years Ago
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I've done this both ways. With stock covers it does prevent them from pulling down. With aluminum the pull down problem is gone. They do look cleaner with the rubber underneath. Question, I have never taken a stock Y-Block apart and found any kind of spacer under the covers. I really doubt the factory did it this way. Anyone else? I think its old hot rodder logic but it does make some sense. Chuck in NH
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By marvh - 15 Years Ago
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I did not believe it would ever be done that way however the parts books show the configuration of being below the covers.
Strange??
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By GREENBIRD56 - 15 Years Ago
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Knowing that the OEM's have a "detail oriented" approach to setting up assembly procedures - it isn't beyond reason that there was once a way to establish the assembly height of the washer/grommet. I also know that (at my old employer) it took a stack of paper you wouldn't believe to get the parts sheets "re-drawn" (in olden times) if they had an error - especially - if it only involved a change of the "picture" (or illustration) and not the parts list. Since we are all practical men who do this mechanical handwork (mostly) for our own enjoyment - you can imagine the words from the mouths of the dealer mechanics after they had adjusted the valves - and then had to "adjust" the valve covers. Yep, probably not what we would share with the girls out front.......
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By rick55 - 15 Years Ago
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The last engine I built (with Edelbrock valve covers) I assembled it with the seals below the cover and had to adjust the height of the seal using nuts and washers. An absolute pain in the butt. It does keep the covers clean with no seepage from under the seal. It does expose more of the seal to hot oil so may eventually affect the life of the seal but no problems so far - three years. So I would say that it works well with aluminium valve covers.
The factory steel valve covers however do not have a flat surface on the inside edge of the cover and I doubt they would seal as well. The edge is folded to give the seal more surface area to contact the valve cover when installed on the top of the cover.
Though I installed them as per the manual I am of the opinion that it was a misprint of the original drawing, realizing that they were probably drawn by a draftsman with no knowledge of engines.
If they were meant to be under the cover on the valves surely they would have worked out some method to do the same on the valley cover, realizing that the method to hold the valley cover is with a bolt and not a stud.
Just my two cents worth.
Regards
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By miker - 15 Years Ago
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apropos of nothing, one of the old timers around here liked my motor, and showed up one day with some familiar looking objects with center holes drilled in them. did you know a Susan B Anthony dollar was the same size as the valve cover grommet washer?
miker
55'bird
32 roadster F code
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By paul2748 - 15 Years Ago
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On both my 54 (312) and my 56 TBird (312) I put the seals on the inside. I also heard that they should be this way. My 239 did not have them this way. Both cars have the aluminum TBird covers. When I put the 312 together, I went trial and error in determining the height and it seems to have worked out ok. What I did was take some self locking nuts (the all steel kind, put them backward on the studs and put a flat washer on that. The seal goes on the washer, but I put in it the valve cover first.
The regular nut that holds the stand goes on first.
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By MoonShadow - 15 Years Ago
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If they did it at the factory I would think they would have used a stud with the right depth thread to set the top spacing or a tube spacer to slip over the stud. I think this could be a debate for the ages. Not doubting the validity of information and opinions on this subject. Chuck in NH
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By PWH42 - 15 Years Ago
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Over the last 50 years,I've had around 60-70 Y-blocks,including some that I know have never had the valve covers off,and I've never seen one with the seals on the inside.Maybe it's a good idea....I've just never seen it.
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By Talkwrench - 15 Years Ago
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Ahh dont worry about it too much whack them in from the top, put a bit of non hardening sealant around them and the gaskets dont crank it down too hard and you shouldn't have a prob! All good Bobs your Aunty!
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By crenwelge - 15 Years Ago
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About 50 years ago, I bought several real low mile motors out of wrecks. I doubt that any of them ever had a valve cover off. I have never seen one with the seal under the cover. Nor have I ever seen a stud with anything that looked like it was designed to hold a grommet. A lot of valve covers were warped by over tightening the nuts. I wonder if it wasn't a fix to prevent this.
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By PF Arcand - 15 Years Ago
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Just to clarify this grommet question a bit, if that's possible?. One of the Doc Fromader project engines had custom valve covers on it. If I recall they required different studs, which may have been a factor in putting them underneath the covers. I've never seen them underneath either, so ??...
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By Ted - 15 Years Ago
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The Master Cylinder (11/22/2010)
I was reading an article on Y-Blocks the other day and it stated that the rubber grommets for the valve covers were supposed to be installed under the valve cover.
I had never heard this before so I looked in a couple of parts catalogs and sure enough it show them in an exploded view with them being installed first on the stud, followed by the valve cover, washer and nut on the outside.From the factory and reinforced in the shop manuals, the grommets are on top of the valve covers, not the bottom. The only reason to even consider putting the grommets under the cover is from an aesthetic point of view and that’s at the risk of having oil leaks at the valve cover gasket itself. Going back to any Ford Shop Manual that covers a Y and reviewing this should remove any doubts how the valve cover grommets are installed regardless of what the exploded views in the Chassis Parts and Accessories Catalogs shows. For the 1957 Shop Manual, refer to page 1-69, section 12 for the proper valve cover grommet orientation.
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By The Master Cylinder - 15 Years Ago
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Thanks for the many varied and interesting responses. My '55 Shop Manual does not show how the grommets were installed and I had never heard of them being placed under the valve cover until reading this article so I threw the question out to the "Supreme Beings" of the site.
Thanks for your answers,
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By DANIEL TINDER - 15 Years Ago
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The only advantage of going through all the trial & error effort of adjusting/installing the seals under the covers that I can think of, might be the ability to finally upgrade from the OEM type neoprene seal which always seems to shred debris that inevitably falls into the oil/valve gear when they are pulled off of the threaded studs (especially when the alum/T-Bird-type covers are removed). With an inner seal improvised from a more durable modern material, it would stay permanently in place on the stud threads, which also might allow the covers to pop off easier, and a more simple silicon-type outer sealing ring/gasket could be replaced when the covers are reinstalled, which would provide an oil-tight seal. Since the inner seal would almost never be removed/pulled off, thus no danger of leaving debris behind that might foul the oiling system.
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