|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
Guys, I'm havig a strange problem. I never used a thermostat on my engine, because down here it gets really hot sometimes, and my car is used more in city trafic, with low speeds.
This is the fact: Ford specifies a 180º thermostat for my engine, and I decided to give it a try. Bought a NOS one, tested it, and works fine, opening at 79º Celsius, that's almost 180ºF.
While running in town, the temperature goes up to 200, and sometimes 220. That scared me. I have a mechanical temp gauge from Summit, and I tested it too, it's working fine. My radiator is the stock one, with a new core (3 row) and a 13 lbs Motorcraft cap. I run new atifreeze, and have no leaks.
I got the thermostat out, and the car runs at 160, 170 all day long, with some rare 190 readings at stop and go trafic.
My question is: Would a lower temp opening thermostat be better than running without one at all? Once the thermostat is open, shouldn't the engine work the same way it does without a thermostat (of course, just never going below the opening temperature)?
|
|
By Ted - 14 Years Ago
|
|
Fuel efficiency will be better with the engine running warmer. Engine wear is also less with the warmer running engines. If the engine is not losing water as a result of boil overs, I wouldn’t be concerned about the engine running 190-200°F.
|
|
By oldcarmark - 14 Years Ago
|
|
The temperature rating of the thermostat controls the MINIMUM operating temperature.The maximum temp is controlled by the cooling capability of the rad,fan,water pump etc.If you change to a 160 stat the maximum temp should come down somewhat but almost certainly it will be higher than 160.You might look into an electric fan and a smaller water pump pulley which would turn the water pump faster.How many blades are on the fan?More blades give better cooling.Is there a fan shroud on yours.Also helps cooling.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
Yes, I have a fan shroud, the stock one, with the factory 7 blade A/C fan. A 160 stat would be nice, but I'll have to buy it from Summit or on e-Bay, because all I could find here are 180. Now, that it's starting to get cold here, my Galaxie is running between 160 and 170. I have some brand new thermostats, one from Ford/Autolite (NOS), another from Rotunda, and one from MTE Thomson, all 180. The one from Autolite has the biggest flow capacity, as the opening is bigger, and the valve opens more. This one was the one I tested. It also has a small 1/16" hole in it, to allow air bleeding. On my 302 powered Galaxie I use a thermostat, the factory original, but it's 160 degree.
Other thing I noticed was the oil pressure. With the stat on, it goes to around 30 PSI at idle (650 RPM). Without the stat, the pressure goes to 40 PSI at idle. I think that's a result of the difference in temperature altering the oil's viscosity. I'm using 20W50 API SJ oil, from Motorcraft (manufactured here by Texaco), that has a high zinc content.
|
|
By charliemccraney - 14 Years Ago
|
|
If you're using the stock sender location for the temperature gauge, then your temperature is actually about 10 degrees higher at the thermostat and that will make it about right for a 180 degree thermostat.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
|
If you mean the hole at the head, then no. I'm using the hole at the intake, about one inch from the thermostat.
|
|
By DANIEL TINDER - 14 Years Ago
|
You could try the wide mouth type Mr. Gasket #4367 (180), or CASCO's 170 if you live near the equator. More flow should help.
Also, since thermostats are fairly cheap devices (buy several/pick the best), I wouldn't trust one that hasn't been tested thoroughly. Penalty for failure is just too severe.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
I found one, from Stant, at Summit Racing (431-13476 part). It's a 160 thermostat.
Since without the thermostat my engine works without overheating, even with the A/C on, I just have to pick one that's good on keeping the lower end temperature without interfering with the cooling capability of the 292.
Around here I have a problem, that is quite irritating. I can find dozens of options for thermostats, if the engine in question is a 302 Ford, a Chevy small block, or a 250 Chevy six. Y-Block? Nope, only factory original NOS stuff with 30+ years old, new parts from MTE, that are good, but all 180, or then import a part from the United States. I live in southern Brazil, and by experience, I would say you can compare the clima with Florida. Miami is just like my city, lot's of cars, and lots of heat.
Due to this, I can buy one or two, but the seller must ship the part to me. Summit does, Dennis Carpenter does, etc, but lot's of sellers don't, so I kind of need to buy a part with a good indication.
|
|
By charliemccraney - 14 Years Ago
|
|
Are there a lot of Mopars over there? They use the same thermostat.
|
|
By GREENBIRD56 - 14 Years Ago
|
|
The big block Mopar thermostat is 52-54 mm diameter - sizes here are 383/413/426/440 cubic inches. When the guys refer to a "big mouth" thermostat they are talking about the diameter of the moving poppet. Many are manufactured with a 52/54 diameter - but the poppet is only 25/26 mm. The ones with the 38 mm poppet are the ones to find. Mr Gasket brand "high flow" is sold here. 
This type is known as a "Robertshaw" type thermostat and they work quite well - have a huge opening. The hole in the poppet support is one of three (about 5 mm dia each) added so that water can pass through when the thermostat is closed. When modified this way - you can put an orfice in the "bypass" hose (that goes out the front of the intake manifold and directly back to the water pump). When you block or orfice this passage, water can't directly bypass the radiator and reheat. A 3/8 std pipe plug with a 5 mm drilled hole, inserted in the tube will do the job.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
The Robertshaw thermostat is the one I have on my 302. I have a spare for these, but it's too small to fit the Y-Block housing. Mopar stats are available here, but only for 318 engines. The ones from Stant, all have the small diameter on the oppening.
Does anybody know any store that sales the high flow stats, with 160 degree, and would ship to Brazil? The ones I found are vague, and by the pictures, they are not the high flow units.
Until I find one, I'll run the engine without the thermostat. The majority of the premature wear would take time to happen, and the engine has a little over 10K miles from a total rebuild. Since the stats are so cheap, and the damage the wrong one can cause is so expensive to fix, I'm willing to weit untill finding a high flow, 160 degree stat.
I'll try Summit again, this time looking for a big block Mopar hygh flow thermostat. Let's see if I have any luck.
|
|
By DANIEL TINDER - 14 Years Ago
|
|
CASCO will ship overseas for an additional $5 doc. fee (sales@classictbird.com). Their 170 degree large-opening thermostat (part # 8575C) only brings my temp gauge up 1/3rd in cool weather. If you can't find the right size Mr. Gasket/Robertshaw in 160, I don't think you'll really miss the little bit of extra latitude.
|
|
By marvh - 14 Years Ago
|
Tulio:
If you pay the shipping I will give you a large 160o Robershaw stat as I have a spare.
Send me a Pm with your address so I can get you the shipping cost.
marv
|
|
By Jimz Bird - 14 Years Ago
|
CASCO has done a bit of work on this and they found that the typical 160 and 180 degree thermostats have an opening of .887 square inches and the 170 has an opening of 1.724 square inches.
Here's a pic of the two.
The have done some other interesting things with cooling also.
Go to here:
http://www.classictbird.com/
and scroll down to:
"Read about our modified water pump"
HTH
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
I found this work of art while looking for a replacement water neck when rebuilding my engine. It's a 160 degree Robertshaw thermostat for a 302 Ford, that someone "adapted" to the outer ring of a 292 thermostat. By it's looks I would say the thing worked for quite some time. If this doesn't proof how difficult it is to find a new 160 stat for a 292 around here, I don't know what would do.
The guy for sure had a lot of imagination.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
|
Guys, Marv is sending me a couple of thermostats, so I think this problem is solved. I have one doubt tough. Anyone knows if the Thermostats for our Y-Blocks are the same as the ones for the FE engines (352, 390, 427, etc)? I found a guy with a box full of thermostats for FE Fords. Not Robertshaw, but looks like they can help other Y-Blockers around here.
|
|
By marvh - 14 Years Ago
|
Tulio:
Some of the FE's take the same thermostat. Some of the later FE's took the smaller stat, so hard to tell unless you know what is the stat number or get him to send you a picture.
Tulio; I tried to reply to your PM however you mailbox is full.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
Marv,
The box says the stats are for pre '67 FE Fords. What you said was the reason of my doubt, as I never dealed with a FE. My friend says they are too big to his 302, so I'm assuming they'll fit the Y.
If so, I gonna tell some friends, so they can have them. Unfortunatelly for me, they are all 180 F.
|
|
By lovefordgalaxie - 14 Years Ago
|
Thermostat installed.
Thanks to Marv, that sent me a couple of Robertshaws, my engine now is running with the Tstat on.
What changed:
At first start in the morning, the engines heats up to 150 F a lot faster, and stays that way (we are in the worse of winter down here, so the temperatures are between 10ºC and 18ºC in average, with some ocasional 5ºC cloudy days). Only when I find some stop and go trafic, the temp goes up to around 160, 165.
The thermostat is correct, opening at 160 F, I think maybe my Summit gauge is a little off, but I tested it out of the car, and it looked to be reading fine, just along with a brand new gauge I have as a spare. The engine is running fine, and pulling like an ox, as always.
I just hope that working between 150 and 165 is not too low, even with the thermostat on.
|
|