|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
Checked the brake fluid the other day and found that the front pot [front brakes] was nice and clean , what I expected to see but the rear was dirty brown..? With the help from my daughter [much kicking and screaming , teenage girls dont like helping their Dads with cars] I had her gently apply the brakes so I could see the fluid move, yep front and rear seem to be fine.
Would it just be crud because of the longer lines?
Also I still have not had much success with the "Old Irish Dave" setup I have, although brakes where not good to start with.. With this type of setup and even the original manual type I should be able to lock the brakes.. I cant even get close, harder I apply the more it fades. Everything seems to be working fine. The only thing I can think of is that whoever did the brakes did not fit the shoes to the drums and the contact area is just not happening, can I do anything about this now...or is the colour a give away to some other problems???
|
|
By pegleg - 12 Years Ago
|
|
I'd try bleeding the rears, and adjusting them by the book. If that does not help I'd question the master cylinder piston size, compared to the original. Also look at the rear brake cylinders for condition.
|
|
By Dobie Gillis - 12 Years Ago
|
|
Are you using the original master cylinder pushrod? Usually they are too short for a dual chamber master. Since the chamber closest to the firewall is for the front brakes they are getting all the "action". The rear brake chamber isn't getting used much, hence the murky fluid and weak braking. Adjustable length pushrods are available. You want about 1/8" clearance between the end of the pushrod and the piston with the brakes released.
|
|
By stlroken - 12 Years Ago
|
Talkwrench, I installed Old Irish Daves power booster and dual m/c last fall on my '56(drum all around). I have had no problems and if I were to do it again I think I would only go with the dual m/c...but I really do have great brakes now. I did have the two piece rod and had to do a little adjusting to get it right. I did call Irish Dave a time or two and he was a lot of help.
I seem to remember on this site quite a while back that someone cautioned to be sure to get the brake shoes on the right way...that its easy to get them switched...you might want to do a search. Hope this helps
Jim
|
|
By sprink88 - 12 Years Ago
|
|
Talkwrench, I have the Irish Dave setup too. BUT I had to go get a longer 3/8 fine thread rod. I have awesome brakes now. Mine is on a 57 Fairlane.
|
|
By paul2748 - 12 Years Ago
|
As was mentioned, make sure you have the shoes in the correct position. The short lining shoe goes on the front, the longer on the back.
Check the rear brakes to make sure they are working. Just raise the car, have some one apply the brakes, and check to see if the rear wheel turns.
With dirty fluid in the rear, check the rear cylinders for dirt/rust. Bleed as necessary to get any "dirty" fluid out.
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
The kit came with a new adjustable rod. You can only go so far with it, pedal is in the right position, even checked the M/c to Booster adjuster, done. Its not going to the floor or anything. All the linings, cylinders "look" to be in as new condition, the brakes where done just before I bought the car, You can even see the coloured stamp on the side of the linings still. Ive checked the linings and from memory where the right way around. Brakes work when you jack it up and lock up no probs.
Im sure I took a picture a while ago of the linings, w/ cyl etc so I'll try to post up later.
I have the brakes adjusted right up.. maybe I'll try to back off and see what happens..
Stumped..Gotta be the linings are'nt fitting the drums..???
|
|
By sprink88 - 12 Years Ago
|
|
like I said with mine, I had the "best" power with the adjusting all the way out. So I went to Fastenal and got a 3/8 fine thread all thread rod and made a longer one. Best brakes now. BUT it is a do or die thing, because that rod coupling is molded onto the allthread and had to cut it off to use the rod coupling
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
|
If you lengthend the rod did that not just move your pedal further away from the floor.. Do you still have the original rubber pedal stop.. You still have abit of "free play" at pedal?
|
|
By Grizzly - 12 Years Ago
|
Talkwrench,
when you installed your Irish dave master what other work did you do to your brakes? If you have rubber hoses that are over 20 years old they need to be replaced. Same with 50 year old hard line. a minimum of kits in slave cylinders when doing this kind of work.
Locking brakes are not a good thing good peddal and effective stopping are more desirable.
cheers
Warren
|
|
By sprink88 - 12 Years Ago
|
|
I made sure I still had free play. Did your car have the bellows style power brakes already. Mine did and I had to remove all of that. Maybe just find a fine thread rod coupling if you can to do it that way instead of cutting your stuff up. I am sure if I stomp on my brakes, they would lock up, but I never needed to. as I have excellent stopping power. The sun will be out today. I will try to take some pics, and look at it closer too.
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
The rubber hoses where replaced even before putting in the dual system. Only the hard lines are old. Wheel cylinders are new[ish] and of the correct size..
Even my old 35 pickup can lock the brakes in an emergency.. how you apply them is a different matter.
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
|
Sounds like the 57 might have a slightly different setup , more so if you already had power brakes.
|
|
By Grizzly - 12 Years Ago
|
Talkwrench,
I'm guessing that the two sources of blackish fluid would be rotting rubber brake components or heat. Check you adjustment of the drums. have you got hard line near the exhaust?
I love those one person brake bleeders. bleed the system and monitor it
cheers
Warren
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
Thought I might of had the brake lines around the wrong way to the M/C. But checked an old Corvette brake diagram and shows front to front, rear to rear, though theirs go through a propotioning valve. Still Its gotta be the right way around. .
Ahh well get back into it when the weather gets better..
|
|
By snowcone - 12 Years Ago
|
Can anyone confirm the correct plumbing for Old Irish Daves dual mastercylinder?
Already in this topic it was said that the front chamber is the rear brakes and then later that the front chamber is the front brakes.
I will be piping mine up shortly and want to get it right first go. Both chambers are the same size so that doesn't give any indication which is which.
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
I think you should contact Old Irish Dave on that one...Put us all to rest. I think Mark has his done as Rear of M/C to front brakes.. . I did it the other way, , corvette diagram shows front to front.
I was looking on the HAMB and just seems no straight answer, some are just plain dumb like " the front brakes will always be the one closest to the firewall."
|
|
By Grizzly - 12 Years Ago
|
Gary & Talkwrench,
You have it right!! The front does the front as if you use a disk brake front you need the larger resivour. I read also that corvette style master can pull air past the slave on drums. I have installed a residual valve which also gives a firmer pedal. This is a win win, better pedal, no air.
Gary, if you are considering disk brakes Hoppers Stoppers has a disk brake conversion for cusso's. I have done this conversion, my oldest vehicle has the best brakes
cheers
Warren
|
|
By snowcone - 12 Years Ago
|
Warren, I'm just using the drum brakes with new hoses, new linings and wheel cylinders as well as Daves dual mastercylinder and booster.
I figured they used to stop OK 50 years ago with a single line and no booster so they have to be better already apart from brake fade, but even that should be better with todays linings.
|
|
By aussiebill - 12 Years Ago
|
|
snowcone (5/29/2013)
Warren, I'm just using the drum brakes with new hoses, new linings and wheel cylinders as well as Daves dual mastercylinder and booster.
I figured they used to stop OK 50 years ago with a single line and no booster so they have to be better already apart from brake fade, but even that should be better with todays linings.
Gary, i,m assuming the m/cyl is for drum/drum application not disc /drum. 
|
|
By Talkwrench - 12 Years Ago
|
|
I believe the setup does both, but not disc disc. Thought I would just check that and looked up Old Irish Dave on Ebay, seems he has closed down. I cant remember anything about residual valves, proportioning valves etc. Just that you just have to keep the adjustment up.
|
|
By snowcone - 12 Years Ago
|
aussiebill (5/29/2013)
snowcone (5/29/2013)
Warren, I'm just using the drum brakes with new hoses, new linings and wheel cylinders as well as Daves dual mastercylinder and booster.
I figured they used to stop OK 50 years ago with a single line and no booster so they have to be better already apart from brake fade, but even that should be better with todays linings.Gary, i,m assuming the m/cyl is for drum/drum application not disc /drum.
Yes Bill, Dave was aware that I was still using drums went he sent it.
Probably why both reservoirs are the same size as I expect the disc brake set up would have had a bigger reservoir on that side
|