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By oldcarmark - 16 Years Ago
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I have been adjusting the valve clearance using a .019 feeler gauge.I can't determine how tight the adjustment should be.How much effort should it take to remove the gauge after locking the adjuster?I know this is something you develop a touch for after doing it many times.I am doing one cylinder at a time using the firing order.Should there be a light valve noise after doing the adjustment or basicaly no sound at all(with the motor running cold at startup).One other thing I noticed is that oil feed to the left side rockers is much quicker than the right side.I have disaasembled the rockers twice to make sure all holes are clear.Is there maybe a partial blockage in the oil passage in the block on the right side or is this normal?This motor was very badly full of crud when I started working on it but now runs very well with no smoke.If there is a blockage in the right side oil passage in the block any suggestions on clearing it without taking the head off.Oil does flow just takes about 3-5 minutes before it starts on that side(at fast idle speed).There was NO oil to either side when I started working on it.Shafts plugged solid.Any input on either question appreciated.
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By GREENBIRD56 - 16 Years Ago
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Mark - How wide are your feeler blades? On mine - after numerous set-ups and then hearing a racket.....I went back and checked the clearance with a dial indicator. I was consistently 1 to 1.5 thou loose - rocker tip wear and the width of the blade was making my readings a bit wide. If you have the equipment to do this check with an indicator - it might show the difference. After I knew this (for my motor) - I used a different feeler - thinner by .001. My uncle was a believer in the - "carefully find zero then back off 1/4 turn" - old school type of adjustment. Then run the engine warm - and if any noise turns up - find the guilty party by suppressing the sound - one at a time - with a gloved finger. Then adjust it warm (and running) until the noise "just" goes away.
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By DANIEL TINDER - 16 Years Ago
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Forum search would likely disclose details re: previous discussion of various cam journal/bearing types and relation to oil flow differences through the years. Partial clog might open more with higher-detergent oil use, but old/total plug likely needs drilling.
Rocker/valve contact wear will also determine feeler gauge accuracy. Do you have jamb nuts? Torquing them always opens clearance a consistent amount on mine. If you also have friction adjusters, pre-calculating change, and using torque wrench & thinner gauge should speed work .
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By kevink1955 - 16 Years Ago
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Check out this link http://www.bigdclub.org/Nuckels/Nuckels1.html About 1/2 way down on the page is the late Walt Nuckles method of 0 lashing the valve then backing off the adjuster. He calculated the thread pitch as to how far to back it off to get proper lash. I have used this method and it does work well with worn parts were the feeler gage hangs up on the wear ridge on the rocker. It's your uncles 1/4 turn method but with calculations as to why it works
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By crenwelge - 16 Years Ago
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I used to hang out at mechanic shops over 50 years ago and watch the old timers. Sometime they ran me off and sometime they explained things to me. I still remember an old mechanic with a short cigar in his mouth telling me to check the valves after he had adjusted them with the motor running. He said "that's why they call em feeler gauges. You can feel when they're right".
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By oldcarmark - 16 Years Ago
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Thanks for the response.My problem I think is that I make it too tight as far as lash.I have the locknuts to deal with which does make it harder to get an acurate adjustment.When the screw is turned down should it touch the gauge and withdraw easily or should there be a drag on the feeler gauge as its pulled out?.Any suggestions about the lack of oil flow to the one side?I had a look at the Walt Nuckles link mentioned.There was a P and G valve gapping tool on Ebay about 3 weeks ago in excellent condition with the original wood box.It went for I believe $280.00.I will give that method of valve adjustment a try.Makes sense as to why it works.
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By John Mummert - 16 Years Ago
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I believe that most of the loss of oil complaints, not caused by sludge, are caused by a too shallow groove in the cam. Ford cams and replacement cams had very a shallow groove for the oil to pass through. As the center cam bearing wears it blocks off the groove. The bearing doesn't wear where the groove is. Logic would tell me that the drivers side would lose oil first, due to camshaft rotation but that's not what I hear from customers. It is common for the passenger side to lose oil first. Maybe the cam chain pulls the cam tight against the passenger side of the cam bearing I don't know of an easy cure if this your problem. The only way to fix it is to remove the cam and cut the groove .015-.020" deeper. Don't make it much wider as this will reduce the bearing surface. If you're down under read this message using a mirror, the passenger side-driver side stuff will make more sense
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By Ted - 16 Years Ago
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oldcarmark (8/20/2009)
...Any suggestions about the lack of oil flow to the one side?...Mark. You didn’t mention if the engine is physically clean in the valve cover area or not but if there is evidence of sludge, then the possibility exists that the oil gallery coming up from the camshaft to the top of the head is simply blocked. Removing the rocker arms on the problem side and pumping the oil hole in the head with oil or white grease can possibly clear the passage. A small piece of flat plate that just bolts to the top of the head with a grease zerk placed over the oil hole works well in these cases in clearing that particular oil passage. Otherwise you’re looking at what John Mummert suggested in that the cam bearing has worn enough to restrict oil flow at the groove in the cam journal.
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By pegleg - 16 Years Ago
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Logic would tell me that the drivers side would lose oil first, due to camshaft rotation but that's not what I hear from customers. It is common for the passenger side to lose oil first. Maybe the cam chain pulls the cam tight against the passenger side of the cam bearing If you could get a cam bearing out of an older motor in one piece you might be able to measure it and determine that. I'd think the forces would diminish the furthur away from the front bearings you got. Your solution, of opening up the back of the bearing with a groove, eliminates this problem altogether.
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By LON - 16 Years Ago
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John , I was just thinking before I read your "Down Under mirror " paragraph ," That happened to me on the drivers side ???? " An oil pump relief valve jammed in a newly( 1500 mile ) rebuilt motor . Stripped the motor ,acid bathed the block ,new rings ,bearings etc,etcAfter reinstalling motor and gearbox ,Fire up "Re-rebuilt #2 " ,drive about 40 mile and all of a sudden ,noisey rockers ???.Pull valve cover ,dry as "Death Valley " .Spun cam bearing .Grease rockers,drive home , pull out motor and gearbox all before sunset ????A day I try not to remember .This happened about 15 years ago .I am sure machine shop used 351 Cleveland cam bearing as replacement . Lon PS .After reinstalling rebuild # 3,couldn't get oil pressure .Look under car to see about 5 Qts of oil .Don't forget to reistall oil gallery plugs in rear of block FIRST .
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By oldcarmark - 16 Years Ago
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Just an update for anyone following this topic.I took the rocker shafts apart again.Still found some of the small oil holes in the arms themselves were partially blocked.Coat hanger wire is exactly the right size to really clean out the holes at front and rear of the arms.I squirted WD-40 down the oil feed hole in the head on passenger side several times,let it soak and applied compressed air down the hole.Readjusted the lash using the 1/4 turn method as described on the other site a member posted.One thing I found handy when trying to keep the pushrods from disappearing down the holes while working and reinstalling the shaft assemblys was to steal 8 wooden clothes pins from the wifes cache and use them to stop the pushrods from falling.Works well.I now have oil to all pushrods from the rocker arms which I did not have before.Oil to the passenger side is about 1 1/2-2 minutes after the drivers side.Seems better than it was before.I am still not convinced that I have the lash right-not noisy at all but it may to too little lash as opposed to too much.For any of the newer members just starting work on an old Y-block :years of neglect as far as oil changes can really plug up the valve train so spend some time taking the shafts apart.Remove the plugs in the end of the shafts,and clean out the accumulated crud inside the shafts and the small holes in the rocker arms and be aware there are 2 holes in each arm.Thanks for the input from everyone.
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By cbass139 - 16 Years Ago
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I was reading this thread and wondering if there was any reason not to start the engine with the valve cover off, when do the "uncle 1/4 turn adjustments"?
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By GREENBIRD56 - 16 Years Ago
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I believe finding the "zero lash" point might be a bit more difficult with the rockers rocking. I regularly tweak things - running - after I do the "zero plus a quarter turn loose" and the engine is warm. Finding a particularly noisy spot by dampening them with a finger isn't too difficult a move - and it seldom takes much of a turn to set things right.
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By oldcarmark - 16 Years Ago
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I can understand how you might "touch up" the adjustment with the motor running after doing the cold adjustment,however my motor being the early 55-56 rocker adjusters uses locknuts on the screws.You almost need three hands trying to adjust and lock it with the motor running.By the way member mctim64 has some great y-block videos available under his "profile" page and I was really impressed with the one on reconditioning and pressurizing the rockershaft assemblys.Great info for us y-blockers!
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By crenwelge - 16 Years Ago
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I still use a tool that was made by Snap-on about 50 years ago. It has a 1/2 drive for the proper socket for the lock nut and then has a knob with a slotted screw driver. That tool does the job of 2 hands with one leaving the other one free to "feel" with the feeler gauge. Those tools appear on eBay quite often. http://cgi.ebay.com/SNAP-ON-OVERHEAD-VALVE-ADJUSTING-TOOL-8-LONG_W0QQitemZ360182526172QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item53dc8d30dc&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
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By PF Arcand - 16 Years Ago
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Just a further note on the sludge problem. Another contributing factor is a plugged crankcase venting system. Particularly the oil filler cap. On a stock engine, the filler cap screen is the "only" intake for crankcase air. They are often plugged with dirt & oil, thereby canceling the crankcase venting. Wash it in solvent if plugged & blow it out with air, if that does not clear it properly, buy a new one. On engines with the side crankcase canister, there is a filter in the canister. Make sure it's not plugged up...
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By DANIEL TINDER - 16 Years Ago
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[quote]crenwelge (8/26/2009)
I still use a tool that was made by Snap-on about 50 years ago. It has a 1/2 drive for the proper socket for the lock nut and then has a knob with a slotted screw driver. That tool does the job of 2 hands with one leaving the other one free to "feel" with the feeler gauge. Those tools appear on eBay quite often.
Similar tool on eBay now (made by Zim), but has built-in dial gauge to indicate screw travel.
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By 56 big window - 16 Years Ago
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something tells me if you had alot of sludge in areas you can see and access , and you have cleaned it and you still have a slow or weak oiler , then you probably need to remove the head and finish the job . Its not difficult , but it is time consumming . Dont forget to remove the oil pan and clean it as well as much of the sludge will settle in the pan and end up clogging the screen . the leading cause of engine failure is contamination .
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