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Another Rocker Arm Assembly oiling problem story.

Posted By bn 12 Years Ago
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bn
Posted 12 Years Ago
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Over the years, I have kept a watch on the oiling of my Rocker Assemblies on my 1956 Victoria. Although the rockers were not getting a lot of oil, there was a trickle of oil out the overflow tubes and there was oil pooled in the bottom of the heads - so I thought this was ok. Recently it became difficult to maintain valve adjustment so I removed the Rocker Assemblies and disassembled them. I found about half the rockers severely scored, as well as the shafts where the rockers run. Since these are the hard to find high ratio rockers (and since I have a lathe with a grinder attachment and a milling machine) I plan to re-bush the rockers and grind the shafts rather than search for high $$ parts.

The first order of business (of course) will be to ensure that the refurbished rocker assemblies will be getting adequate oil - and this is what has me stumped right now. I removed the spark plugs so the engine will crank fast and after about 1 minute of cranking there was no oil at all coming out of either oil port in the heads (the low oil pressure red light does go off shortly after cranking begins). Next, I took an oil gallery spiral wound brush and turned it counterclockwise with a drill motor (to bring sludge, etc out the top of the port). I did get thick sludge, but nothing solid. Still no oil out the ports while fast cranking. The following is what really has me baffled. I applied compressed air to the top of the Driver's side oil port and I could hear air flowing out the upper oil breather and the Passenger's side rocker assembly oil port. Next, I applied 90 psi air to the Passenger's side oil port. There was no air flow at all. Then I rotated the engine by hand in small (about 3 Deg crankshaft increments) and applied air again to the Passenger's side oil port after each increment. I did this for over two complete revolutions at the crank. There was never any air flow. What I don't understand is how there could be air flow coming out the Passenger's side oil port while applying air to the Driver's side oil port. Does the same cam bearing supply oil to both banks, or is there a separate cam bearing for each bank? Any ideas, comments, etc would be greatly appreciated.
DryLakesRacer
Posted 12 Years Ago
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I'm definately not an expert on these engines but for all I have read the same cam bearing feeds both sides. I believe it's #3. The engine in the 56 I bought was overhauled by a reputable shop in Phoenix (I was told this) and there is not much oil coming from the over flows but it must be adequate as I have no noise from the valve train. If I was assembling the engine I would have done everything I could to ensure adequate oil by doing the cam bearing reccommendations online here and other places...Good Luck

56 Vic, B'Ville 200 MPH Club Member, So Cal.
bn
Posted 12 Years Ago
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Thanks for replying DryLakesRacer. My engine wasn't making any noise either, except for the loose tappet I kept having to adjust. Yet, as I said, about half the rockers were severely galled. I'm about to go nuts trying to figure out why I can blow air through the Driver's side oil port, but can't on the Passenger's side. My Vic looks just like yours - Peacock Blue and Colonial White.
charliemccraney
Posted 12 Years Ago
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The left and right banks are fed by the same cam bearing.

You say there is never any airflow but then you ask why air comes out the passenger side while applying air to the driver side. If you are getting flow between both banks, then there is not a blockage after the cam bearing, but there may be one at or before the bearing. Have you installed a pressure gauge to see what the pressure is?

Your rocker arm adjustment issue may not be related. There are two types of adjusters. One is only a screw. The other is a screw and jam nut. If yours are the screw type, they do wear out over time and will loosen. If you have the jam nut style, then something else is going on and it is possible that oiling is the problem.


Lawrenceville, GA
bn
Posted 12 Years Ago
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Sorry for the confusion. When I apply air to the Driver's side oil port, there is air flow. I can hear air flowing inside the crankcase and also out the Passenger's side oil port. When I apply air to the Passenger's side oil port, there is no air flow at all.
The Horvaths
Posted 12 Years Ago
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Might be time to pull the heads and clean out the passages. I'm thinking trapped crud acting as a "valve" or blown head gasket.
Where exactly does the air come out of passenger side when applied to driver's side? Get a friend to check if you need to. Can't really use soapy water, but, it did occur to me.
bn
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Your thought about "crud acting like a valve (check valve) offers about the best possibility of what is going on here.

I just finished doing the air pressure test one more time. I'm using an air nozzle that has a rubber tapered end and holding it in the oil port inlet tightly so that it seals perfectly. This time I filled both ports with ATF just prior to doing the air pressure test.

Applying 90 psi air pressure to the Driver's side oil port: I hear a lot of air flow inside the crankcase. The ATF fluid is barely bubbling out of the Passenger's side port (about an eye dropper per second). So, there is for all practical purposes no air flow out the Passenger's side port.

Applying 90 psi air pressure to the Passenger's side port: I can detect no air flow anywhere. No AFT fluid coming out of the Driver's side oil port at all.

Now I'm beginning to think that oil flow to both Rocker assemblies was shut off recently and suddenly. A spun cam bearing perhaps? I don't like the thought of installing an external oiling system, but if the engine has to come out it is going to be completely rebuilt before it goes back in and that's not in by schedule (or budget) right now.
The Master Cylinder
Posted 12 Years Ago
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I don't believe that the rocker arm/shaft wear you described occurred "recently and suddenly". It sounds like the type of wear that occurred over time.

That said your problem could be cause by a couple of things. The plugging that was already discussed but it could also be caused by cam wear, either from excessive clearance or the center cam journal groove being blocked from bearing wear and blocking the groove.


You could also have blockage in the transition between the head and block, where the oil passage makes a jog. I think the first thing I would do is yank the passenger head and see if you get oil out of the block. Before replacing the head open up the oil passages in the area to prevent future blockage.


Good luck and keep us posted.

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The Horvaths
Posted 12 Years Ago
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I agree. I would encourage you to bite the bullet and pull the head(s). If the bottom end's in good shape, a date with some Clover Compound, new seals, open up the oil passages, and she's good to go. External oiling might be a temporary inexpensive option, but, if flow is excessive you could be robbing Peter (bottom end) to pay Paul (top end).
bn
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Thank you Master Cylinder and Horvaths. It's been about 50 years since I pulled the head off a Y-block, so maybe it's time (in more ways than one). I think I will go ahead and refurbish the rocker arms and shafts (as I mentioned in my first post of this thread) so it might be awhile. I will post what I find.

When you say "open up the passages" are you referring to just cleaning them out real good, or actually removing some metal?


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