yeah i need to do some load runs. i tried this before but with my timing issue any time i tried to load it down I'd get a bunch of backfires and couldn't put my foot in it. i think we have a storm coming in again this weekend and i don't have windshield wipers so it may not be till next week.





also i did not do a timing chain, i did a ring job, rings, rod bearings and gaskets. i did not even pull the motor to do it. i did however have the heads looked at, the seats and guides had normal wear and tear on it and "should have hardened exhaust seats installed" but if i go that far i might as well do a whole head job, and if i put that much money into heads i might as well get the higher compression heads, then do the work on those... sad fact is I'm on a budget here...

I notice you asked about smoke on decleration. Nobody answered you. Usually oil smoke on decelration will turn out to be valve seals. Could be worn guides, or old cracked seals. That and the fact your compression numbers are low makes me think it's time for a valve job.  

Frank/Rebop

Bristol, In ( by Elkhart) 

It did not smoke till after the ring job besides that I had the heads inspected.

"Normal wear and tear" does not necessarily mean good to go. It can mean there appears to be nothing out of the ordinary but it is time for a rebuild. Were the heads disassembled? The condition of the seals may be difficult to determine with the springs in place.

It is an easy job to replace the stock type seals at home. A spring compressor is the only special tool required. At the same time, you can clean, visually inspect, and lap the valves. All of this should be easy to do on a budget. And after all of this, you will know if it's about time to do a good rebuild on them.

Are you able to do a leak down test?


Lawrenceville, GA

Yes he took out the valves and we looked at the the seats. Basically the heads were not new (of course) but they were not bad either if they had the hardened exhaust seats he would not recomend any work at this time however he made it a point to suggest hardened exhaust seats and that if I were to do the seats I might as well do the whole head job.



The heads are used but ok.

were new valve stem seals installed. if the seals are hard they will let oil past and create smoke. new rings probally increased the vacuum which can increase the leakage around the seals.

Kenny  Onalaska, Texas

The seals were not replaced.



Increased vacuum could make sense however the improved seal that would create more vacuum on down strokes would also cause increased compression on the up strokes. The compression numbers did not increase so its probably safe to say the vacuum did not improve either.



Perhaps the problem is not the heads but the rings that have not seated...

If it is rings, most likely the oil rings were installed wrong or there's too much end gap. If it's not using a lot of oil And you get a large cloud on start up, the culprit is likely the valve seals. 

Frank/Rebop

Bristol, In ( by Elkhart) 

it doesn't smoke on start up.



it smokes a little bit from the crankcase, road draft, oil filler dipstick tube, which most likely points to RINGS. the smoke would have to get past the valve seats not be sucked back into the cylinder by the intake or pushed out the exhaust and flow through a second seal the, valve guides, in order for the oil being put into the cylinder by valve guides to cause smoke in the crank case, I'm not saying its imposable but common sense and critical thinking would say that it is improbable.



It smokes after its up to operating temp it smokes more at a stop light after a small load (stop and go driving) and smokes the most when i cruise at highway speeds. (get up to speed and let off the gas) the rings are not quite seated yet (as evident by the lower compression numbers.) there is too much oil in the cylinder as i create the lean condition in the cylinder by closing up the carb the cylinder temperatures increase and the only fuel left in the cylinder is the oil left by the improperly seated rings. thus a nice cloud of blue smoke. if i get back on the throttle just a little bit, cylinder temps drop and there is more gas in the cylinder, smoking clears up or stops.



the final piece of the puzzle, is the fact that the smoking has slowly begun to clear up as I've driven it. because of my timing goof i have not been able to do the 40-75MPH load runs to finalize the seating. I've done maybe 3 since i did the ring job, just running on ramps. from point A to point B. i need a sunny day to take it and do the load runs to get them to seat.



BTW how could you improperly install the oil rings? if the top and bottom keeper rings are in the right spot, the middle expander ring is non directional. actually the only directional ring in my hastings kit was the second compression ring, which i checked, no joke, 4-5 times before i installed each piston.



I know its hard to diag things over the internet, and really, i appreciate the help, but wouldn't it make sense to insure the rings are seated before i go blow another couple hundred dollars (actually closer to a grand, not to mention my time) because a couple guys on a internet forum who have never seen my car nor the way it smokes in person, have a hunch that its my heads? please don't take that the wrong way, as i say i appreciate that you are willing allow me to bounce ideas off this board and give me feed back, but really its getting a little ridiculous to assume its my heads and come up with every argument you can think of to support your theory, when you have no hands on experience with the vehicle you are trying to diagnose.



its easy to be an armchair mechanic and throw parts at a problem when its not your time money and effort going into it.



let me satisfy my theory that the rings have not set, once i do that if it still smokes I'll be right back on here to hear your theories about my heads.

Are you sure about that 1st ring? All 3 usually have some direction or order in which they are installed.



The thin oil rings usually have a ledge to hold the middle piece away from the cylinder wall.


Lawrenceville, GA