[quote][b]Ted (11/30/2012)

This then leads me to believe that this same ‘ethanol drop out issue’ can potentially take place to some degree in your daily driver vehicle.



With what consequence? Initially, if the pickup point in the fuel tank is higher or lower than the separation/stratum level, you would then be burning either pure high octane gasoline (assuming the ethanol has absorbed all the water), or a mixture of alcohol and water which might lean out the charge, but should resist detonation and burn cooler (?). If driving around, wouldn't the gas and ethanol soon remix, nullifying the dropout effect?



I quit using StaBil years ago since it sped the deterioration of Viton accelerator pump cups & float needles, but I'm now considering their Marine blend for the snow months. In a pinch, my '55 still has it's orig. gas tank with drain plug. I see an alcohol test kit in my future.

6 VOLTS/POS. GRD. NW INDIANA

Hutz.  Ditto on the fuel consistency.  The jury is still out here on whether gasoline or ethanol makes the most power.  I’ve done repeated tests on the dyno for customers with both and it all hinges on the carburetor on which does the best.  If limited to pump gasoline and a 91-93 octane level, then alcohol is the obvious choice for high compression or boosted engines but once the gasoline octane is matched to that of alcohol, then alcohol no longer has that particular advantage.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)

Daniel.  No reason to avoid it if that’s all you have.  And octane is octane so it really doesn’t matter what the fuel is as long as it keeps detonation at bay.  The ethanol laden fuels do have a propensity for the ethanol portion to drop out of suspension and the shelf life is reduced also.  I’ve found up to 30% ethanol in gasoline purchased from those stations that do not turn over their gasoline storage tanks very often.  The water attraction issue with ethanol laden fuels makes any moisture that accumulates in carbs and the rest of the fuel system a problem also.  All this reminds me of that old quote, “Other than that Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?”.

 

But with all that aside, the major problem I have with ethanol laden fuels is consistency in the percent or amount of ethanol that’s in the gasoline.  For testing purposes, any variance in ethanol amounts makes for inconsistency in the air/fuel ratios when doing an above average number of dyno pulls where the engine is requiring more than a simple five gallons of fuel.  Nothing worse than have a combination sorted out and then a fuel change requires a jetting change in which to keep testing variables to a minimum.  In a street driven vehicle, this same inconsistency would be a tank to tank issue.  The 312 dyno mule with its 400+ dyno pulls on it would be a great example of why I would want some consistency in the fuel.  By simply testing with ethanol free gasoline, at least one level of inconsistency is removed from the equation.

 

If you’re not testing the fuel for ethanol content, you really don’t know what you have.  I can still get ethanol free premium grade gasoline at the pump but I’m finding that I must shop around for it now as the premium fuels are now starting to show up randomly in my area with some ethanol in it. And once the stations storage tank has been adulterated with ethanol laden fuel, it takes awhile to get rid of that even if subsequent loads of fuel have no ethanol.  The fuel tanker drivers tell me that the ethanol is added to the gasoline at the local fuel distributorships as the gasoline is ethanol free when loaded at the refinery.  The exception to this is where the refinery is in the same geographic neighborhood that the fuel makes its final sale.  There seems to be an issue with the ethanol dropping out of the mix when hauled for long distances which is why the ethanol is added closer to the point of sale and not necessarily at the refinery.  This then leads me to believe that this same ‘ethanol drop out issue’ can potentially take place to some degree in your daily driver vehicle.

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)

You can actually make more power with Ethonal as long as your engine is tune for it.  Ethonal burns leaner so it requires more of it to maintain proper airfuel ratio.  We use E85 on all of our high performance engines.  I am running it on my 62 F100 292 and it works great. It also keeps the combustion temps down because it burns cooler.  If you run a fuel with a percentage of Ethonal in it your engine will not perform as well because it was originally intended to have pure gas in it.  If you cannot find fuel without a blend in it you could tune your engine slightly richer and might help.  It would require dyno testing and air fuel ratio monitors.  We do a lot of performance tuning and I agree that finding consistent fuel is a big issue.

[quote][b]Ted (10/9/2012)



"I do end up doing frequent checks on my end to verify this simply due to using a considerable amount of pump gasoline on the dyno"



Ted,



I could see why you would not want ethanol in pump gas used for dyno testing (lower energy potential=lower HP), but aside from the usual complaints re: gasohol, as long as the minimum required octane is there, any reason to avoid it for high CR engine break-in? All the premium available in my area has ethanol.

6 VOLTS/POS. GRD. NW INDIANA

Problem solved. All valves working properly after lots of Marvel Mystery Oil and WD-40. Thanks to all. Alan

I did a check the premium from a local station a couple weeks ago. It was about 5%. I use premium in everything. Maybe that's why I haven't experienced the same problems others have with ethanol. I've had 0 problems with it.

You can pick up ethanol free gas at lawn related stores. You can even order pales or barrels if you wish. It costs more than the stuff at the pump, though.


Lawrenceville, GA

It’s a relatively easy and a two minute check to verify exactly how much ethanol is in a given gasoline.  While I’ve found an excess of the labeled amounts of ethanol in the lower octane grades of pump gasoline, I don’t find any in the premium gasoline being sold in my area.  While it’s suppose to be a country wide mandate to not have any ethanol in premium gasoline, all I can verify for fact is it’s not in premium gasoline in my area.  I do end up doing frequent checks on my end to verify this simply due to using a considerable amount of pump gasoline on the dyno.  I get very constant results on the ~10% ethanol in 87 and 89 octane fuels but absolutely none in the 92-93 octane gasoline.

 

Here’s a picture of a commercially available ethanol tester but a tester can be made out of any kind of clear tube that’s gasoline compatible.

 

Lorena, Texas (South of Waco)

Doesn't that depend on the fuel brand/station location? I had always heard ethanol is sometimes used as an octane booster. Website listing of ethanol-free gas outlets becoming shorter, I notice.

6 VOLTS/POS. GRD. NW INDIANA

The only way that I have been able to keep my small engines, lawn mower, chain saw, weed eater, generator ect running the last couple of years is to use Sea Foam or some other stabilizer in the gas. The ethanol will eat up rubber products in a matter of weeks. I think if I were storing a car for more than a month I would use an additive or as Ted stated us a non blended fuel if you can find it.

Glen Henderson



Freedom is not Free

Letohatchee, AL