I agree with the "not too crazy" approach - over the last 40+ years I've been guilty of "over-doing" several projects. This T-bird was intended to be a streeter/driver kind of car (turn the key and go wherever/whenever) and hopefully I can keep things down to a dull roar.....

I figure that the factory fuel pumps on these mid-fifties Y's weren't intended to feed the engines any more than Ford engineering felt was "necessary" for a family sedan. The exception being the dual carb and supercharged versions - and they had different fuel supply equipment too. When we hop them up and give the engines the ability to accelerate beyond the requirements of the family sedan - there are instances where the carb basically just gets low on fuel and limits the rate of acceleration. If we don't spend a lot of time at the track, just gun it a bit on Saturday nite - it may not be worth the moola to upgrade beyond "cruiser " status. However.......instant throttle response does have its safety aspects, right? 

I've ordered up some steel needle and seat assemblies for the Demon - the originals act sticky to me - and Hoosier has made a few comments about troubles with the common Viton tips. So she's going to end up with some .130's - and I quit.....no more souping up the fuel supply.

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

Thanks for the response!  Im guessing Ill just go with the Airtex, as my engine isnt anything crazy....

I guess the real question is if you feel that fuel delivery may be part of my problem, or if im barking up the wrong tree?  Im not particularly good at troubleshooting, especially carb/fuel issues, so any insight is really appreciated.

Thanks!

Ron Grove

Wauconda, IL

I think that any of the three you linked will work - the Carter is probably overkill. From what I saw on Al's dyno sheet - and the comments of others with pretty hot running cars - a pump that can supply 30 gallons per hour at 4-1/2 pounds pressure will do the deed. The Holley pump has a data sheet that says it will do that - and the Summit pump (and the Airtex #362 which appears identical) should do it too. I got my Airtex pump from Rock Auto for $47 - so the prices are all in the same ballpark.

Because they only come with 1/4 pipe thread inlets - be careful about strangling the suction side of the pump.

I would say that it would be wise to beware of using just any old FE size/fit fuel pump - many I looked at are plainly not the equal of the versions we are talking about.    

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

Iv been followign this thread with great interest.  Ive long had the suspicion that my pump isnt keeping up.  It cant keep the glass filter bowl full, and it stumbles for a fraction when I floor it in passing gear, even having gone to much higher jets and lower power valve, etc.  (New plugs, wires, cap, rotor, timing good (although total advance seems a bit high at around 50 deg; 10 deg initial) pertronix, etc., engine only has 10k miles on it, holley 390 carb with a little bigger cam).  Could low fuel pressure be the culprit?  Is having to go to much bigger primary jets out of the box on this carb possibly due to low fuel pressure/volume?  Most people around here seem to have most carbs work great right out of the box....

IF so, would any 390 or 427 pump work, like these:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2D250006%2D1&N=700+115&autoview=sku

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=HLY%2D12%2D832&N=700+115&autoview=sku

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=CRT%2DM4008&N=700+115&autoview=sku

I dont need the vacuum pump portion, but would prefer something that is NOT chrome.  So does it seem like fule delivery might be the issue, and if so, are these (or any others?) good options?

Sorry for the simple question, but Ive forgotten what little I knew about tuning carbs, and NOBODY around here knows squat about how to open a hood.

THANKS!!!!

ron

Ron Grove

Wauconda, IL

I've been using the Holley high performance pump for a 427 FE for years. Plenty fuel pressure and chrome too! Chuck in NH

Y's guys rule!
Looking for McCullouch VS57 brackets and parts. Also looking for 28 Chrysler series 72 parts. And early Hemi parts.

MoonShadow, 292 w/McCulloch, 28 Chrysler Roadster, 354 Hemi)
Manchester, New Hampshire

FYI, Steve or anyone else that is interested, I just bought one of those Holley 80 gpm fuel pumps (7.5psi) last weekend after I notice my car surging. Determined it was the fuel pump as my clear fuel filter by the carb would fill 3/4's of the way and then bubble down to almost empty. I suspected a rip in the diaphram of the stock dual vacuume pump. I asked for a fuel pump to fit a 390 at a local speed shop and they gave me the Holley. In the written instructions, it lists Y-Blocks and all FE motors. It works great, car runs perfect!

On another note, I still have the vacuume wipers and just plugged them into an intake port. They work fine too, no difference from being hooked up to the fuel pumo!

Rob

I love the smell of burning rubber in the morning!

The Airtex #362 pump arrived and I rounded up enough fittings and tubing to put it on there yesterday. Came out OK I think, still haven't installed any of the pushrods so I'll wait to start it later. The inlet and outlet are 1/4 NPT and positioned toward the left rear if you just take it out of the box and try to put it on there. The pump lever pivot is located way closer to the flange face than the Bird pump, which makes the diaphragm move farther with each stroke and jumps up the volume.

Turning the inlet/outlet to the "right" position is a case of learning by trial and error. There are 10 scews so you have a few choices to sort out. Mine finally ended up so that the outlet is 36° left of dead ahead. When you take the bowl screws out - be prepared for the diaphragm to disengage from the operating levers and fall out of the dumb thing (could be that the dummy is talking here). Getting the devil back together is a case of "learning to hold your mouth right" - a phrase I learned from a banjo picking friend.

My advice (if yours falls apart) is to carefully remove the small diameter lever return spring (directly under the operating lever) - it can fly and will also fight everything you try to do. Then wrap a rubber band around the operator lever to hold the smaller lever inside (that actually engages the slot in the diaphragm operating rod) out into a position where you can actually maneuver the rod back into engagement. Once you've got it back engaged, subsitute the lower bowl for the fingers you have holding the diaphragm. It helped me to find three screws that matched the bowl screw threads - but were about 3/4 inch longer - to start it all back together. After a few trials you will either get good at this or resort to drinking. When everything is back as it should be - cut the rubber band and reinstall the return spring.

Test it one last time before you bolt it in - to be sure it has stayed together internally and will actually pump.

The 90° double flare fittings I found had tiny internal passages and I opened them up as much as I dared by drilling. Also did a bit of "porting" on the inlet elbow to make sure I didn't build in a suction restriction. You can reduce pump efficiency more easily on the intake side than the pressure side. The rule of thumb for hydraulic pumps is usually to make the suction side twice the size of the pressure side - and that holds for this type of pump too. 

Yeah, I know - the rear upper A-arm bushing is trashed.....

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona

Yep! gas line from the tank too the fuel pump on the bird is 5/16. The #362 cleans up the area around the pump as well.

-Gary Burnette-

Hey Steve;  Had same problem, only single, no vac ports,.  Shimmed up front mount 2 washers, also adjusted steady mounts up some.  Pump is a Carter with anew design ( tin bottom).  Hope this helps and hope this gets to you have not been able to login all this week!!   God Bless    Eddie

Eddie

Lake Forest, Ca.

Eddie

Lake Forest, Ca. 92630

According to the Holley information on their 80GPH pump (that looks just like the #362 Airtex to me) - you can "clock" the lower housing to suit the required inlet/outlet angle. In any case Gary must have overcome this on his '56 so...........

One thing I did notice about the Holley parts sheet - it says (*) the inlet and outlet ports are 1/4 NPT - and all of the other 80 GPH pumps say 3/8 NPT. It must be becasue of the factory Ford fittings its supposed to be used with on the 428 FE. Inverted flares no doubt. So -----if a guy wanted a lower housing with more flow potential - you'd have to swipe one off a chebbie or other suitable boatanchor. 

 
 Steve Metzger       Tucson, Arizona